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For Newbies - Read!!!!


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#1 Charles King

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Posted 18 January 2009 - 10:54 AM

1. This is a steadicam forum

2. This place is only for steadicam products or any higher brand system

3. Anything under the cost of a steadicam or higher brand system will be responded in the same manner - Buy a steadicam system or higher brand system.

4. Do not expect a Steadicam operator or higher brand operator to respond with an answer like - 'Buy a Flycam 6000/9000, Basson, L'aigle or the sort, instead of a steadicam or higher brand system.

5. Do not expect an answer to be anything other than a steadicam system or higher brand.

6. Like many other members have said. This forum was made for the operators in the professional world or upcoming operators with steadicam operating ambition.

7. This forum was not intended or created for anything low-budget.

8. Do not ask the same question hundred times when you cannot be bother to do a search.

9. If you expect the pros here to give you better judgment than to not expect them to recommend something you definitely can afford just to be able to fly a rig. The experiences here are based on many years of hard work and practice. Most major operators have not tried any of the lower brands...After why go for the least when you can get started with the best ;)

10. One major respond to all newbies is - TAKE A WORKSHOP!!! You will definitely see the difference and understand the performance of these brand systems everyone is talking about.

11. Steadicam and higher brand system cost a lot but for what they can do you will understand why.

12. If you want to know more about the cheaper system, then please visit: DVinfo.net , HBS board. This way there is a little of everything that will satisfy the curious minds.

13. If you cannot afford these brand systems then wait and save up for them.

14. If you need one for anupcoming shoot, then rent one.

Edited by Charles King, 18 January 2009 - 11:02 AM.

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#2 Charles King

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Posted 18 January 2009 - 11:12 AM

Forgot to mention, that these are a compilation of points that have been pointed out for newbies who continue to repeat the same ritual of questions on this board:
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#3 Matteo Quagliano

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Posted 18 January 2009 - 05:37 PM

Sorry to disagree Charles. If I would have follow your points I wouldn't have been where I am now. And 90% of where I am now is due to this forum. Even if my now it's very little and very poor I think is not the brand that makes an op but the passion. For the questions repeated hundreds of time you might right, eve if I disagree on that too. ;)
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#4 Sam Morgan Moore

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Posted 18 January 2009 - 05:49 PM

Forgot to mention, that these are a compilation of points that have been pointed out for newbies who continue to repeat the same ritual of questions on this board:


I guess I am a guilty party - asking about flying a $800 DSLR of all things - how low can you go !

I would suggest that technology is going wild

The next generation of Reds or DSLRs will probably hammer the quality that a lot of current cameras weighing 20lbs

Steadicam is opening up to everyone

Maybe you dont want to be part of that game - then the forum should be renamed 'feature steadicam' or something

I can see the appeal for you amazingly dedicated guys and gals of not dealing with people who are just passing through and not dedicated to thier particular art/craft/business

I personally am extremely serious about my work which has been the aquisition of journalistic stills for the top news publications in the UK for nearly two decades - I dont like to blow my trumpet but am in this case

Those same publications are now creating 'journalistic motion' and need people to aquire it (you will note that that art has most definitely not been mastered !) - light weight steadicam looks to be a superb tool for those who are looking to aquire it in a creative and artistic manner

Do you think us people are somehow 'not serious' or 'cheapskates'

Rarely does cost come into the kit equation for me, (check out the prices of ealy digital stills cameras)

I dont, however, have ambitions to work in the 'movie feature industry' - Im interested in recording reality

I have bought the cheapest and smallest Steadicam product and considered more expensive models but dont think that they will work for me, not because of thier cost, or lack of my commitment to the art, but because I have made a decision that small and nimble will enable me to get to places and see things I couldnt get to or see with a full rig

This is a development in technology in the same way that the steadicam was a development over the dolly and track or the 'sat-phone' is over the 'sat truck'

I also see a lack of existant products and skills based at 'flying small' which there will be a revolution in and if the traditional manufacturers are not with that program they will get hit

On the workshop front I am resistant there too - not because of lack of commitment or cash, but because I dont think established skillset is the same as the skillset that is required for 'flying small' - learning to fly a traditional boradcast camera is just not relevant to me

A new skillset, mindset and kitset needs to be developed - if that is not on or around this board then just make that clear - but remember we new kids may get the hang of flying the new 2lb RED (in 2010) from in a canoe or off a mountainbike before you guys do - exciting times for all

Just a thought or two

SMM
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#5 Amando Crespo

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Posted 18 January 2009 - 06:40 PM

Hi Charles!....
You´ve reason....
Can I said you a thing about your post?.....
Do you remember a TV. comercial spot from BMW cars with BRUCE LEE...?

"BE WATER...MY FRIEND"....!!!

Best regards.


(You´ve reason.... But... Should be great that the TOP-TEN operators gives us a bit of their experience with all friends of "steadicam comunity"...From the newbiest who only dream with fly a gear to the highest op.) :) :) :))
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#6 Charles King

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Posted 19 January 2009 - 02:14 AM

Just to add that my post in no way is an indication of being selfish, inconsiderate or rude. It might have or will give the impression of being anyone of these things but if you read throughout the board you will notice questions, replies and comments that have been posed with the exactly the same issues I have described. So, just thing of this as a guide before posting such common questions. I have seen post where no one replies simply due to the same facts I have mentioned above by newbies. The operators themselves have mentioned this over and over again. So I am not really saying anything new. But if my post offense anyone or the Admin disagrees with my points then please, by all means, remove this thread. :) I will still have a smile on my face. No worries...

I too have been a newbie but I tend to read the rules, comments before ever posting something. I rarely post a question if I do find it on this board or on my own board. I do realize that budget is a big issue but if you do intend on coming to a professional forum with something other then a high brand system and intended on hearing something like buy a Flycam 6000 then you will certainly be mistaken. I state again that my points are gestured to wards those who request anything other then a high brand system, but expect someone to say the Flycam is a better buy than a flyer... It's been said many times - You get what you paid for. ;)

I am not saying to not post on operating and inquires of steadicam or higher brand systems but the usual inquires like which system is better - A Steadicam or a Flycam 9000 or something to that effect.

Cheers everyone.

Edited by Charles King, 19 January 2009 - 02:21 AM.

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#7 Charles King

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Posted 19 January 2009 - 02:29 AM

This can be a sticky or not. Regardless, I think it will save most newbies from the embarrassment of not getting a respond or being told off. At least I think so... :rolleyes:
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#8 Fabrizio Sciarra SOC ACO

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Posted 19 January 2009 - 04:12 AM

This can be a sticky or not. Regardless, I think it will save most newbies from the embarrassment of not getting a respond or being told off. At least I think so... :rolleyes:


Hey Charles, totally agreed with all of your points, good idea to make it a sticky, it could help to keep clean the newbies section from redundant questions of people passing by the forum and addressing the usual common questions without even trying to perform a SEARCH before posting and pretending an answer that has been given hundreds of times in the same way before.....

To Sam, this forum still named "Motion Picture Camera Stabilization System Specialists",
and I think it doesn't need to be renamed in a while because of "technology going wild", we all know that, but, for the meantime, a 7000 dollars gimbal still works better than a 70 dollars "gimbal", and despite some opinions, this place is still dedicated to discuss the high brands that pros use to own on their respective fields.
As Charles suggested, some other forums has dedicated sections and those kinds of questions will find better answers, as the majority of fellows here, never flown low budget "steadycams".

To Matteo: passion is a great thing, is the power to go ahead, but I seriously doubt is enough to show up on set;
skills make the difference between an Operator and another, and usually in this field skills are gained attending workshops with top rated operator, and in most cases more than once...
Not to mention the investment in the equipment, which still makes a huge difference on the rates that we are able to give to producers......but don't want to go there and open a big can of worms, it could get really harsh, nothing personal of course!

My morning toughts

Best to all
F
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#9 Sam Morgan Moore

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Posted 19 January 2009 - 05:48 AM

To Sam, this forum still named "Motion Picture Camera Stabilization System Specialists",


That is a very fair point :)

S
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#10 Matteo Quagliano

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Posted 19 January 2009 - 07:17 AM

to Fabrizio: it depends on which set you are talking about. the sets I frequent are low low budget. if people here thinks that money makes the difference then I leave today. I can make it even without the forum. it's really mean to consider an operator from his equipment, I saw shit stuff produced with a lot of money and shit stuff remain even if an Ultra 2 was involved, and at the same time I saw great stuff did with little Flyer (5000 euros.... it's high brand but costs nothing... mmmmmmhhh may be the operator does the work...) or other less branded equipment (not to mention what all the great ops does, cahnging and building their own equipment at their taste, for that it's educative the back stage of Any given sunday, take a care look at Muro's running rig, again an mmmmmmhhhh arise to my mouth)... so I don't get the point of trying to close the forum to all the people that for many reasons does not have an high brand equipment, also because everyone starts like that, unless a nice and rich daddy cover the BIG starting expences on that very expensive world. And the points of Charles were more for respect (in a sense of self respect and respect for the others) then for a cleaning istance. if you're bothered with newbies section just don't get here around (as Amando point out with his great BE WATER ;)

in the end if the point is a money issues, rates and costs of equipment, then you have loose a great fan of this forum, me. it's not the first time I got caught on a money issue like that and it gives me bad impressions (both of the times were from europeans like me, again an mmmmhhh) .... lukily then I go on the thread I open with the same stupid and repeated questions and I see there're a lot of great people (before of being great ops) that share their experience regardingless the equipment just feeling the passion and a big smile come back to my mouth :D

in my will there's obviuosly a high brand rig but before that I have to have the jobs for that marvellous and excellent performing rig, I don't want to buy a Ferrari to drive in country roads, I want a Ferrari for when I'm going on race track. and I'm sure that when the jobs arrive then I'll be ready for buying and performing this art, very modestly.

nothing personal from me as well...
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#11 Charles King

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Posted 19 January 2009 - 11:02 AM

Hi Matteo. Thanks for your comments. I understand where you are coming from; I do not own a major high end rig. I am currently putting my together from parts I've purchased from Steadicam operators to professionally CNC'ing my own parts... So there you have it. I know of a fact of operators who are flying rigs that are not commercially bought. So please do not take my list of comments to heart. The list, as I have mentioned is a list that I have complied from this very forum based on the responses and/or comments and empty inquiries. I am only saying what the forum requires of the members here. I do not own a full Steadicam gear, but I know this is not the forum to ask about low budget systems and which to buy. If you read through some of the post here you will find posts with these inquires and responses with pretty much what I've written. So I am in no way attacking the newbies inquires to learn about the Steadicam system or higher brand systems... Hope you understand me now. :)
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#12 Matteo Quagliano

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Posted 19 January 2009 - 11:59 AM

Hi understand you perfectly Charles, and I want to say I have a great respect for Fabrizio's work as for others pro ops that are here on this forum... I mean that a newbies section is just for the boys, who have will to talk, confront, ask... may be the same questions hundreds of time but I think is good like that (when is done with respect and not with arrogance) and if sometimes big ops come with a word it's only good for us newbies.
The search option is something you're right, there's plenty of infos in here. so it might be good to start with that but to be honest I also received sometimes the answear do a search before. but then the thred become interesting giving the chance to talk and confront upon my job and other ops job. I think it's good.
What I didn't like was the equipment limitation but now I understand you better.
thanks for the clarification
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#13 JobScholtze

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Posted 19 January 2009 - 05:28 PM

Hey matt, you have learned my friend, hehehe. ( You know what i mean right? )
Makes me proud. You will be there sooner then you think.


Greets
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#14 Amando Crespo

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Posted 19 January 2009 - 07:00 PM

Hey boys....!!!!.....
TIME TO PEACE!!... Or I´ll leave free my "Ninja´s pacemakers :ph34r: :ph34r: :ph34r: :ph34r: :ph34r: :ph34r: :ph34r: :ph34r:..."
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#15 Matteo Quagliano

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Posted 20 January 2009 - 04:43 AM

I apologize if I seem aggressive, it wasn'y my intention at all, PEACE

ps. Amando I'll always follow your words but never leave your Ninja peacemaker, they can make disaster

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
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