Jump to content



Photo

Just a thought- need feedback


  • Please log in to reply
7 replies to this topic

#1 costasflex

costasflex

    Member

  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 21 posts

Posted 16 June 2004 - 09:08 AM

Hello. I have a project going and I would like to see your oppinion about this.
Since Iam a steadicam and jimmy jib operator and have designed some personal gadgets here and then recently I have made a small remote head that is for cams
between 1-5 kilos.It weights 1.5 kilo its wireless pan and tilt and its also stabilized electronicaly in pitch and roll axis so can keep perfect horizon if its nicely balanced.
Iwas planing to run this on a remote cable rig.I had in mind small HD cams, and also Iconoscope s16- 1,5 kilo, and A- minima aaton s16.Since the head is very nice in stabilizing horizon and pitch errors as well as wind errors - have tested it manually hand held - I made some designs of making a boom sled that it can be placed on a steadicam arm, length 2-3 meters telescopic from center, 1 meter tail.
This way I can do some extreme low mode to 3 meter high mode moves,manual pans and remote pans and tilts very much like a small remote crane using a joystick,can fly over obstacles like tables and other surfaces and do all that while walking.
From some breef calculations the system with monitor bats and 2 kilo camera will weight 17 kilos.It utilizes 2 gimbals one manual like steady type and one electronic on the remote head.How do you find this option as a complete system?
Of cource you have to be trained to operate joystiks married with steadicam tecknics but is that interesting?
I will try and get some videos down as soon as I finish it and see how it goes.
I would appreciate some feed back.
Thanks
Constantine
  • 0

#2 RobVanGelder

RobVanGelder

    Advanced Member

  • Sustaining Members
  • 919 posts
  • Bangkok, Thailand

Posted 16 June 2004 - 08:05 PM

Constantine, I have seen a similar device about a year ago on the the IBC, made by a french company. Yours sounds abit more complicated/sophisticated.
The french one didn´t work with a steadicam arm,it was a boom system with a support to a belt around the hips, a pole to chin-height and a 3 meter boom formard, 1,,3 meters behind.
All controls were manually and the operator could really make nice shots, from floor level to max height.
Tilting the pole at the waist would make the camera tilt, I´m not sure if the pan and tilt on the little remote head was electric or with cables.He could make a dutch angle too by rolling the whole boom in the gimbal.
At that time the guy didn´t try to put it on a steadicam arm, but by now he has maybe

This was a rig for small cameras only but they come in HD version too nowadays.


Rob van Gelder
  • 0

#3 Bryan Trieb SOC

Bryan Trieb SOC

    Advanced Member

  • Sustaining Members
  • 151 posts
  • Los Angeles / Toronto

Posted 16 June 2004 - 09:20 PM

I've used a similar contraption which was called POLECAM. In my opinion this rig is best used for extreme type sport coverage. Eco-challenge...at the top of the ramp for ski jumping.....situations in which the advantage of having an operator move in and out of challenging terrain and banging off shots. Some of these rigs even have underwater cams which can be dipped like a fishing pole under water. That being said...it's no replacement for a proper Jib crane. YOu can not walk and make a smooth shot at the same time. The head isn't stabilized by anything except for gravity, so it wobbles terribly if you're walking or scurrying to repo.
Perhaps it's a different design than the rig Rob's talking about, however it looks quite similiar and I would caution anyone to really test out this rig before making a purchase because from what I remember it's very expensive for what it is.

I'm curious about Constantine's idea. I've often wondered how to make a steadi-jib combination (since I have one of each!)....but could never figure out how the operator could endure the weight/counterweight on the body for full sized cameras. .....uh...Alien?....damn I'm curious to see that rig!
  • 0

#4 costasflex

costasflex

    Member

  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 21 posts

Posted 17 June 2004 - 03:31 AM

Well there are a few differences and a few drawbacks .
As I said this I design for these wonderfull very light S16 cameras, and small HD.
something like a special rig for special shots.full size cams is out of the question,only maybe a modified arri 2c made of CF like the one was made in the flying eye project - remote arship -but that is not for my pocket.
There are a few reasons why I think my boom will work on the steadi arm and the booms above wont.First of all the french boom cant be balanced.it has an enormous bent at 3 meters.so even wit t a gimbal you will have errors mostly horizon..The pole cam is even worst in that point no gimbal and no horizon compensation in any way,your body talks.
But this little tricky head of mine,has this intelligent electronic gimbal above it,and no matter what the angle of youy body or the booms is,it keeps perfect horizon.
So this way you do not need a gimbal after the arm,even if I have added one in the design for even better.
Drawbacks.
much heavier than other body systems above - with cam 27-33 kilos complete.
No roll motion, or dutch roll.
No full size cams,special rig for small cams.
Adavandages.
exeptional horizon and pitch stability from body or wind errors.
super low to super high mode with full manual and joystick pans and tilts.
The first prototype of this inteligent head I have made for my airship can be seen
at my site whitch needs updating www.flexy.co.gr
the new one is made very differently with cf tubing but the mechanisms are work the same way.
please do not comfuse it with the allien,nothing like that,small system for clever shots.
Thanks for the feedback guys
Costantine
  • 0

#5 costasflex

costasflex

    Member

  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 21 posts

Posted 17 June 2004 - 04:03 AM

picture of the old intelligent head I have made for my airship.
The new one is much smaller and light with different design but same mechanics and electronics

Attached Files

  • Attached File  head.jpg   55.83KB   11 downloads

  • 0

#6 RobinThwaites

RobinThwaites

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 383 posts
  • Pinewood UK

Posted 17 June 2004 - 04:12 AM

Hi Constantine

For your info Steffan (from Polecam) and I have tried mounting a Polecam on a Steadicam Master arm and I can honestly say it was one of the strangest and most uncontrolable things I have done. It seemed like there were far too many variables although your gyro system may help. Also you may find it better not using an IsoElastic arm as you need too many hands.

Incidently although Polecam was conceived as a body mounted unit, it most often gets used on a stand.

Another combination of body mount and stabiliser that I have seen was a russian Steadicam copy (all made of stainless steel - weighed a ton!) with a small gyro ball device on the top. The operational problem was that it was configured so that the camera was not controlled by the wearer but by another guy with a radio control system.

Sorry I did not mean this to sound negative - keep experimenting!

Robin Thwaites
OpTex
  • 0

#7 costasflex

costasflex

    Member

  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 21 posts

Posted 17 June 2004 - 04:37 AM

Polecam I had a go 2 years ago on a tripod and I liked it.It moved nicely.
Iam 100% sure that with some convertion of mine, adding gyrostabillity and 2 extra gimbals I can make it work on a arm nicely.
Thing is that its very expensive for experiments so I will make my own.
Thanks .By the way any photos of this gyro russian system or a site or something.
Curius to see it.
Constantine
  • 0

#8 RobinThwaites

RobinThwaites

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 383 posts
  • Pinewood UK

Posted 17 June 2004 - 08:22 AM

I don't have any picytures but look at http://www.hovercam....steadimount.htm

Robin
  • 0




GPI Pro Systems

Paralinx LLC

IDX

Varizoom Follow Focus

Wireless Video Systems

rebotnix Technologies

BOXX

Betz Tools for Stabilizers

PLC - Bartech

Teradek

SkyDreams

Ritter Battery

Omnishot Systems

Engineered Cinema Solutions

Boland Communications

Media Blackout - Custom Cables and AKS

PLC Electronics Solutions