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video glasses? tried em yet?


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#1 thomas-english

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Posted 30 March 2004 - 04:01 AM

i tried some video glasses a while ago and they were too immersive to be any good for a clumsy operator like myself.. but theres these new ones.

http://cgi.ebay.com/...&category=15215

anybody had any experience and/or opinions on this kinda bussines?

anybody seen a cheap dodgy (CHEAP) aspect ratio converter?

I reckon these could be the future.... but im sure lots of people would disagree and i d like to know why!

wicked

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#2 RobVanGelder

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Posted 30 March 2004 - 11:56 AM

I never tried it but what I have read a while ago ( last years forum?) that the use of these glasses can make people feel disorientated, cause nausea.
The reason being that with most systems/glasses you kind of loose your sence of direction and horizon. However, this system could be a bit different, as it only uses one eye and leaves most of the field of view available for orientation.
There is another company in the US that makes simelar things for one eye, but with a more obstructive projection in front so it could be hard to see depth.
With this system there is a chance that it works. Check it out please and report!
( if you can miss the money) ;)

Rob van Gelder, Bangkok, Thailand
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#3 Anthony Hardwick

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Posted 30 March 2004 - 05:26 PM

I just tried a similar set of video glasses (made by SONY) a few weeks ago on the feature I am operating on. I was testing out whether or not they would be helpful to operate a shot where the camera was jammed into a very uncomfortable and nearly impossible position to operate (non-steadicam). Even using an on-board monitor was difficult for this shot because of the massive pan that the shot required and the fact that the only place I could physically be did not allow me to maneuver myself into a a position to easily view the LCD screen throughout the shot... damn the lousy limited viewing angle of many on-board LCD's!

In any case, the other operator on our show owns a pair of these glasses, and I tried them out during a few rehearsals of this shot. The action I was trackiing was a basketball being shot to the hoop.

I found the glasses to be pretty disorienting, and in fact I opted to not use them for this shot in the end. Instead I did the usual contortionist routine we seem to have to do every now and then. I do see how these types of glasses MAY be good for certain shots. In fact they may be the ONLY way to get some shots. Following action with them is difficult and counter intuitive though, because of the spatial disorientation caused by the disconnect between your vision and your various other senses (inner ear in particular). I think with some practice I could have made the system work for me, but on a feature with only a few minutes before the take, it wasn't enough time to be proficient with them.

If any of you has tried walking through that amusement park gimmick of the rotating "star field" tube while trying to maintain your upright and balanced posture, you know what I mean by spatial disorientation.

Another analogy might be the one where you have a set of headphones on and they feed you your own speech at a delayed interval (say a 1 to 2 second delay), and you try to speak normally. It is very difficult.

In any case, the other problem with these glasses is that the resolution is pretty poor. At least they were with the model I tried. The SONY model is no longer manufactured, and it was never sold in the US. The menus were all in Japanese, so that made setting them up "interesting," to say the least. Thankfully, our loader speaks and reads Japanese fluently!

Just my .02 cents... I hope that helps.
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#4 thomas-english

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Posted 30 March 2004 - 06:10 PM

where they the full "eye covering immersive type"?

i am hoping that only having one eye and only a corner of that eye may do the trick....... especially as u could use your monitor as usual , and switch to glasses on those changeovers, don juons etcetc and particularly blarring suns!
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#5 Anthony Hardwick

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Posted 30 March 2004 - 09:12 PM

The ones I tried were full covering types, but they had an opacity adjustment that lets you dial in whatever amount of opacity you wish. In other words, you could have view the real world through the glasses with an overlayed image of the video feed. Sort of like a double exposure photo. This was difficult to get used to, I think a one eyed version, or a corner of the lens being clear would be better for me. Having done many years of hand held documentary shooting, I am very used to walking around with my right eye open in the finder, and my left eye looking out at the world. I leave both open, and I guess my brain switches the view rapidly as needed for navigation. I've gotten pretty good at it over the years, and I don't need a spotter except for walking backwards.
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#6 TJ Williams

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Posted 25 April 2004 - 08:38 PM

In the way back The master GB Himself tried using a fiber optic to one eye. My recollection is that he felt this was too disorienting since the pov of the lens and the other eye were so far apart. Anyway he dropped the idea. Perhaps now that we are all more evolved this could work. A coupla years ago I got some glasses that made a translucent video image in front of me. It looked like a translucent big screen tv about 6 feet away. Big problem was that any fast movement and the slight movement of the glasses on my face created very large sickening lurches of the virtual image out front. So also very tight head band ie like for pickup basketball may be good.
TJ
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#7 iankerr

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Posted 27 April 2004 - 01:25 AM

Glasses...Schmasses. Check this out:

http://news.bbc.co.u...ogy/3647437.stm

Might be awhile befoe it makes its way to us but...

IK
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#8 RobVanGelder

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Posted 27 April 2004 - 09:52 AM

I saw the site with this laser glasses. Although it´s very interesting, I have the feeling that the basic problem that people have with this kind of vision is still the same, and it does not really matter how these pictures come to us.

It´s allright if you sit in a chair, or stand relatively in one place (surgion, car-mechanic) but the moment you start walking and this picture, which could be a view from a distant place relatively to your own eye, (low-mode, high-mode, DonJuan) superimposed on your frontal view, while avoiding curbstones, stairs, extra´s, doorways, etc, I doubt if (m)any people can work with it.

It´s probably too much information for one eye/brain in the setup that we want to use.

Just my thought though, I really want to try it out once!

Rob van Gelder
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#9 YecidBenavides

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Posted 06 May 2004 - 12:41 AM

Hello,

I´ve used the full glasses before. I don´t recall the name brand because they weren´t mine. I tried them on for several days, and found them to be completely disorienting as it was said earlier. I found myself moving my head side to side or up and down instead of panning or tilting my rig. It sounds funny, but it´s a whole different can of worms. I wouldn´t recommend it to anyone no matter how many eyes they cover or how see through and laser beamed they are. The only way I could see them working is in a relatively static shot that will not go on to quick movement. Running with these things over your eyes is not only dangerously distracting but also is nauseating. It comes down to this. One´s eyes are used to acting much like a gimbal - they stay in one place and pointing at a certain direction regardless of the movement of the head. This is what our brain and eyes are trained to do. The moment you strap something to your head, which is moving, and try to look at it with your eyes, you have a problem. The way I see it is, it´s the same as if you tied your sled post to your body¨ It defeats the whole purpose of isolation. It´s kinda like if you tried to film an earthquake with your rig. It would look shaky no matter what. I found this to be exasperating and nausating. Keep any kind of monitor or viewfinder on your rig.

Good luck,

Yecid Jr.
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#10 RobVanGelder

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Posted 06 May 2004 - 09:44 AM

Hi Yecid,

Welcome to the forum ( although you are looking since januari) and I must congratulate you on your first post. It is clear and to the point and we don´t see that so often from first posters!

So you tried those glasses for days and give them a thumbs down. The same reaction as Garreth had in the first stages of Steadicam.

But there might be a use for it, now that I think of it.
It´s the setup with the RollVision ball, where the operator of the rig and the one of the camera are separated. We can put the glasses on the man with the joystick! He won´t be moving anywhere :D

Rob van Gelder, Bangkok, Thailand
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#11 YecidBenavides

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Posted 06 May 2004 - 01:52 PM

Thanks for the warm welcome, Rob. It´s the first time I post in any forum. I used to not even look at them, but in this one I just seem to find pithy information wherever I turn. I really appreciate that. Oh...the whole RollVision thing sounds pretty interesting. Looking forward to trying that.

Yecid Jr.
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#12 RodCrombie

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Posted 17 June 2004 - 04:54 AM

[FONT=Arial] :ph34r: I have a set of sony glasstrons, (about 5 years now), and have used them for various shots where I couldn't get my head near the camera. I wouldn't dream of using them while using a steadicam. If you cant see your monitor then there is something wrong with the way it's set up.

I found them the most useful while using remote heads in full sunlight and the supplied monitor is really flared out. As others have said, they can be very disorienting, so practice with them first.

cheers
Rod
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#13 JasonMcKelvey

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Posted 17 June 2004 - 11:38 AM

It's my understanding that most everyone has a dominant eye. This eye, when presented with a different picture than the submissive eye, will be the picture chosen by the visual cortex as the brain can only process one picture. There is a simple test to figure out if you are left or right eye dominant... but I forgot it. I'm left eye dominant (left handed too, if that makes a difference) so when operating a hand-held camera, if I keep both eyes open, the image from the viewfinder in my right eye will fade out withing a few seconds as my brain starts concentrating on my left eyes picture. My point? If the video image is only in one eye with these glasses, will it fade out, or the opposite... will the ground fade out?

Jason
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