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Bartech or RTmotion?


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Poll: Bartech or RTmotion? (15 member(s) have cast votes)

Bartech or RTmotion

  1. Used Bartech Analogue + one M-one motor (9 votes [60.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 60.00%

  2. RTmotion + one brushless motor (6 votes [40.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 40.00%

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#1 Victor Lazaro

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Posted 19 April 2013 - 06:07 PM

I am looking into getting a wireless focus system and I took it down to two choices.

A used Bartech Analogue, with an m-one motor, or get the RTmotion MK3 with one motor.

 

- With the bartech I get a powerful motor and robust system which I have to manually calibrate and only one motor, and limited possibilities to expand.  What about the debacle on the M-One maintenance?

 

- With the RTmotion MK3, I'm worried in going with a new system, with less feedback, but I get the bonus of having a very small receiver with automatic calibration that I can upgrade to multiple motors later down the road.

 

 


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#2 Martin Stacey

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Posted 19 April 2013 - 08:45 PM

There is a third way now that brings the best of both together. The Axis1 is digital, has auto calibration and the motor is stronger and faster than the M One without the service headache. Just a thought.

Cheers
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#3 Joe Lawry

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Posted 19 April 2013 - 09:07 PM

Another vote for the Axis1 - http://hocusproducts.com/axis1.php


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#4 Victor Lazaro

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Posted 19 April 2013 - 09:32 PM

So, the Axis 1 is even more expensive than a new Bartech digital. So you would choose the Axis over a Bartech Digital?

I am looking for nothing more expensive than a used Bartech Analogue...

 

RTmotion MK3 1 brushless motor - $2,970.24

Bartech Analog + M-One - $4,600.00

Bartech Digital + Heden - $5,278.00

Axis1 Hocus - $5,559.68


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#5 Martin Stacey

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Posted 19 April 2013 - 11:03 PM

Yeah quality always does cost a little more. But what is that worth when your M One is out of action for months waiting for repair?
However if your mind is already made up I have a spare BFD M One set that I was thinking of selling.
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#6 Victor Lazaro

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Posted 19 April 2013 - 11:39 PM

Thanks. My mind isn't made up, but my wallet is tight I'm just looking for what will be the best bang for the buck.
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#7 Tian Shen

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Posted 19 April 2013 - 11:40 PM

Hi Victor,  

 

My two cents worth.    

 

I've owned the Bartech Digi/Heden (Ver 1) and RT Motion Mk2.  

 

If cost is a factor, and it is a choice between the Bartech and RT Motion. I'd go for the Bartech.  

 

However, with the M-One motor on going service issue and not many makers of analog motors nowadays. I would bite the bullet and buy a Bartech Digi (Ver 2). You get auto and manual calibrate and have 16 bit resolution compared to 12 bit for the analog) or HocusFocus Axis1.  

 

I personally went for the HoFo Axis1 mainly for the speed and ability to do really slow racks, auto and manual calibration, auto lens torque detection, the motor will freeze if it detects something jammed up between the motor gear and lens, so that you don't end up accidentally grinding or damaging your cables or fingers.  

 

You can buy a RedRock Micro Torque motor ($500) or soon to be released Red Technica Element Motor ($1200 ?) as a spare if anything should happen with either systems.


Edited by Tian Shen, 19 April 2013 - 11:46 PM.

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#8 Peter Hoare

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Posted 20 April 2013 - 10:41 AM

Hi Tian, 

 

The end to end resolution of any FF system is limited by the resolution of the knob on the hand unit. The motor can't move by more steps than there are on the knob. As most systems use a potentiometer and analogue to digital converter to measure knob position, resolution is limited by the A to D, which on most micros is 12-bits. Axis1 uses a digital knob sensor with better than 16-bit resolution, maintaining the full 16-bit motor positioning resolution.

 

Pete.


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#9 Osvaldo Silvera SOC

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Posted 20 April 2013 - 11:37 PM

     I've had 2 Bartech's since they came out, sold them during times where I was on a very long job with no chance of steady, and then bought others when steady type work started up again. I've never had a problem with them. Service is top notch. ( just checkouts and preventive check ups)  I have the Standard model with the Focus handset and the version with the Slider handset which I use for Iris control. I thought about getting a digital receiver and adding the slider module to the side of the handunit, but more often than not, I end up handing the slider unit to a DP to control the Iris when needed, so I have never spent the money to do that upgrade to the handheld focus unit.Every operator works on different types of shows. Not everyone needs all the toys, for instance I've never owned a Preston...Just under 16 years since I bought my 1st full size rig... I would get the BFD digital receiver for the auto calibration, but a lot of my work is live TV where I pull my own focus, and as far as I know, there isn't a digital system with a hardwire servo so I can control the focus on the gimbal, This is the reason I've never switched to Preston.

     I've used the Stanton system for some shows and it is fantastic I must say, I believe I will probably purchase a system one day just to have it.

I plan to purchase one of their motors exclusively for jobs with broadcast Canon and Fujinon lenses. In preparation for that  I did have Jim modify one of my receivers with a High /Low switch on the board, so I can use a Bartech receiver and power/control a Stanton focus motor on Fuji/Canon lenses. This way I save the weight of the rod, and the Focus motor on the live shows and still use the small hard-wire box from Jim under my Zoe zoom control.  The M-one motors I have have been great, I purchased them used, one had a problem and I sent it in to get calibrated, got it back within 3 weeks, I may have been lucky, but I've never had an issue since.. 

     My opinion and advice is Get what will do the job now, planning too much for work you don't yet have with gear purchases just doesn't make business sense. That's how I ended up with every specialty low mode bracket there was, extra cables for panavision, moviecam ( 2 versions), Aaton, even the Kinor russian camera power cable, seperate cables for every video tap made, etc.. 90% of that stuff was sold at a huge loss after years of those cameras never being introduced on any of my jobs.   There are successful ops running 30 year old 3A rigs, with no fancy donkey box, adjustable battery boxes, or sliding monitor mounts, standard definition monitors, and the old giant turd batteries, the only upgrade they've done to their gear in 30 years is buy a Decimator 2 and keep on truckin, and bringing in the checks.

I've been to Terry Wests' house several times and seen rigs that look like they should be in a Steadicam Museum and he's just adding an SDI/HD

run from top to bottom, of the non telescoping post, or adding an extra power connector, and off it goes for another 10 years of service..

 

Get what you can.. If you want a particular unit or system, and save up the money to buy it new, keep in contact with the manufacturer or seller to see what they have in stock, Buy it only when you have a job coming up that will use it. until that moment, it's best to leave the cash in the bank making money instead of gear in your closet depreciating  value.

How many of us have purchased gear, had it Fed Ex'ed and have used it once or not even once. Sure the fed Ex is deductable as part of doing business, but the interest on your money you didn't make is an $ opportunity lost.

Enough rambling.....Fly well

Ozzie


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#10 Robert Skates

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Posted 26 April 2013 - 08:50 AM

Avoid the M-one motor. The rental house I work for sent our M-one motor for repair in early February. They promised us it would be repaired and returned multiple times. Phone calls and emails go unreturned. 2 weeks ago they sent a Fedex tracking number but never shipped the item etc. Seriously avoid the M-one motor or look at it as a throw away item once it fails.


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#11 RonBaldwin

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Posted 26 April 2013 - 01:38 PM

Just a note...I have seen Peter's new system and it is really cool and fast!!

ALSO...the Bartech will work with most any motor out there...it's a shame that the Loonworks bs is tarnishing Jim Bartell's stellar rep. His customer service has always been top notch and bfd's workhorses

Ron
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#12 Daniel Stilling DFF

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Posted 27 April 2013 - 07:49 AM

Heden motors work great with the BFD.
Great combination, this way you won't have any service issues...
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