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Cinetronic HD7


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#1 Jens Piotrowski SOC

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Posted 02 March 2012 - 01:17 PM

I was feeding the Cinetronic a composite signal from my Ultimate with PDL overlay and the backlight was changing brightness every couple of seconds. Anybody had the same problem.....?

Thx,

Jens
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#2 William Demeritt

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Posted 02 March 2012 - 02:02 PM

What camera were you using? I've experienced a similar problem with the RED One/MX, which I correlated to the HD-SDI jitter in all video outputs.
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#3 Eric Fletcher S.O.C.

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Posted 02 March 2012 - 02:09 PM

HD-SDI can have frame sync issues with can cause flicker, the fix is usually to reboot (Pull power and plug it in) so that it can pick up the frame sync again. Interestingly if you down convert HD-SDI you won't have the frame sync issues. (Which is why most "HD" monitors don't have that issue)
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#4 William Demeritt

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Posted 02 March 2012 - 02:58 PM

I just found an HD-SDI amplifier/Reclocker for $200, gotta make a cable and actually fly a RED to test it. I'll post the results.

Rebooting the monitor through cable power cycle or the button never solved the problem long term for me. Maybe a solution will appear in the next version/upgrade of the monitor?
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#5 Richard James Lewis

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Posted 02 March 2012 - 06:03 PM

Are issues with this super monitor starting to appear?

I've been waiting for about 9 months to buy this Cinetronic. I've just been stalling for now until the newer, smaller one comes out. I really need a digital bubble in my life.

I did some tests with the Transvideo 8" HD and the old UltraBrite the other day. The UltraBrite won hands down out of the two of them in direct sunlight. 1000 nit v 1400 nit. Neither were truly astounding tho. I can only expect the 1500 nit Cinetronic to be slightly better than the UltraBrite no?

Should we worry about the life span on these things. I know that Tiffen messed around with the older SD monitors that were 500 nit, and boosted them to 700 nit. I've heard from various people that these screens didn't last more than a few years. Fortunately mine is still working at the moment.

Are Cinetronic driving these panels harder than they should be to get that extra brightness?

Has anyone had any issues with their monitors at all?

I'm totally up for this change over to the Cinetronic, and I have been in touch with Chris for a while now, and he has been nothing but prompt and helpful. I'm sure if there were an issue he would be there to help. Just thought it was worth a bit of discussion tho.

Rick.
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#6 chris bangma

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Posted 02 March 2012 - 08:33 PM

We have seen this problem a couple times, when the monitor is used with the XCS level. When the level is bypassed, then it does not happen. It seems that with some cameras, the output from the XCS is a little too high, and causes sync problems. This is only a problem with composite.

As for screen longevity, many of the older high bright monitors like the Tiffen, and Boland monitors used a CCFL fluorescent backlight. These backlights had a limited life, and created a lot of heat, which shortened the life of the panel. All of our screens use an LED backlight, which runs much cooler, and lasts much longer.
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#7 Jens Piotrowski SOC

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Posted 03 March 2012 - 01:42 PM

What camera were you using? I've experienced a similar problem with the RED One/MX, which I correlated to the HD-SDI jitter in all video outputs.



Red One MX with 1st gen Redbyte DC.....I thought the Redbyte has a build in re-clocker? Charles?
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#8 William Demeritt

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Posted 03 March 2012 - 02:24 PM

Red One MX with 1st gen Redbyte DC.....I thought the Redbyte has a build in re-clocker? Charles?


The Decimator 1 might, but I know the Decimator 2 does not have a built in re-clocker, as was confirmed by Decimator Designs via email. The only device by Decimator that has a reclocker is their MD-RDA (reclocking distributor amplifier).

I found another device for half the cost, but it requires 5v (at 0.4 amps), so that's the cable I gotta build.
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#9 William Demeritt

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Posted 03 March 2012 - 02:34 PM

This is only a problem with composite.


I'm not sure that's the case, as it almost ALWAYS happens with my monitor with the RED One/MX.

Here's a video of it happening:

http://www.wbd3.com/steadicamforum/backlight_issue.mov
http://www.wbd3.com/...light_issue.mov

Doesn't ever seem to happen with any other camera running off the HD-SDI feed (Alexa, F900, AF100, F3 and F35 flown, no video issue). The only reason the Red MX stands out, as I've researched, is that it has terrible HD-SDI jitter issues.
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#10 Jens Piotrowski SOC

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Posted 03 March 2012 - 02:42 PM

This is only a problem with composite.


I'm not sure that's the case, as it almost ALWAYS happens with my monitor with the RED One/MX.

Here's a video of it happening:

http://www.wbd3.com/steadicamforum/backlight_issue.mov
http://www.wbd3.com/...light_issue.mov

Doesn't ever seem to happen with any other camera running off the HD-SDI feed (Alexa, F900, AF100, F3 and F35 flown, no video issue). The only reason the Red MX stands out, as I've researched, is that it has terrible HD-SDI jitter issues.


thanks for posting this, but my issue shows up complete different.

it looks like the back-light is switched between 50 and 100% every 3 to 4 seconds.....

will investigate further, never ever had the issue with Hummingbird in the same configuration, weird
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#11 chris bangma

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Posted 04 March 2012 - 07:25 PM

Jens, bring your sled in, and we will take a look, and fix whatever is going on.
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#12 Jens Piotrowski SOC

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Posted 05 March 2012 - 06:35 PM

We have seen this problem a couple times, when the monitor is used with the XCS level. When the level is bypassed, then it does not happen. It seems that with some cameras, the output from the XCS is a little too high, and causes sync problems. This is only a problem with composite.

As for screen longevity, many of the older high bright monitors like the Tiffen, and Boland monitors used a CCFL fluorescent backlight. These backlights had a limited life, and created a lot of heat, which shortened the life of the panel. All of our screens use an LED backlight, which runs much cooler, and lasts much longer.


After spending 2hrs testing today with Greg Bubb I do no longer believe that this is caused by the XCS sled or PDL.

I suspect the problem lies within the HD-SDI signal of the RED One MX or it's down-conversion with the Redbyte. more testing....
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#13 Jens Piotrowski SOC

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Posted 06 March 2012 - 03:27 PM

Red One MX with 1st gen Redbyte DC.....I thought the Redbyte has a build in re-clocker? Charles?


The Decimator 1 might, but I know the Decimator 2 does not have a built in re-clocker, as was confirmed by Decimator Designs via email. The only device by Decimator that has a reclocker is their MD-RDA (reclocking distributor amplifier).

I found another device for half the cost, but it requires 5v (at 0.4 amps), so that's the cable I gotta build.


RE: reclocking, here's the solution:

http://www.bhphotovi...stribution.html

(3G version is available for extra $50, MSC-HDDA4 G3)



and to power it:

http://www.nebtek.co...Battery-Adapter

the plug size is 2.5mm and 5v !!!
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#14 William Demeritt

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Posted 06 March 2012 - 03:50 PM

RE: reclocking, here's the solution:

http://www.bhphotovi...stribution.html

(3G version is available for extra $50, MSC-HDDA4 G3)

and to power it:

http://www.nebtek.co...Battery-Adapter

the plug size is 2.5mm and 5v !!!


Bought that exact amplifier. I'm going to make a d-tap cable to run off my sled base and one for the camera port on my PRO sled to rig it up top. Low power draw is nice, but it's a hefty little bastard.
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#15 Jens Piotrowski SOC

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Posted 06 March 2012 - 07:47 PM

RE: reclocking, here's the solution:

http://www.bhphotovi...stribution.html

(3G version is available for extra $50, MSC-HDDA4 G3)

and to power it:

http://www.nebtek.co...Battery-Adapter

the plug size is 2.5mm and 5v !!!


Bought that exact amplifier. I'm going to make a d-tap cable to run off my sled base and one for the camera port on my PRO sled to rig it up top. Low power draw is nice, but it's a hefty little bastard.


FYI power draw is 260mW and max voltage 7.2
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