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HD monitor upgrade for a Flyer Le F24


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#1 Rusty Geller

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Posted 10 February 2012 - 10:12 AM

Sold my PRO and down-sizing to EPIC proportions. I have a line on a slightly used Flyer LEF24LEVLBH but would have to upgrade it to HD. Can anyone reccommend a reliable monitor under 2 grand with frameline generator and electronic level, good outdoors with a wide viewing angle, that will power by 4-pin XLR and have HD/SDI BNC & HDMI input?
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#2 Robert Starling SOC

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Posted 10 February 2012 - 11:09 AM

The Holy Grail is what you are seeking!

I think Rob Vuona was using a TV Logic that was in the mid $2k range but I don't think it had adjustable framelines much less a level or HDMI. I don't think it played well outdoors either.

Ron Baldwin was using a Nebtek and may still be but I don't remember the features and I'm pretty sure you're closer to $4k.

Go back to the old "Monitor Shoot Out" thread, read past all the "arguments" and maybe there's some info on the Marshall monitors in there you can use.

Good luck!

Robert
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#3 Andrew Stone

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Posted 11 February 2012 - 11:26 AM

Rusty,

The Marshall 651STX ticks most of your checkboxes but it doesn't do image flip and there is no yoke for it. The electronic level is an add-on and you have to fabricate a device to protect the USB connection as one knock into a doorframe would probably damage it. The framelines are preset but there are quite a few to choose from.

There is a used Nebtek Solar on the site right now that you should definitely look at. Check the weight though. Should be OK. The Marshall once you kit it out will be well into the $2,000s. Someone mentioned that Marshall did a software mod to the 651STX where if you turned the monitor 180 degrees the image would flip. I haven't seen or heard this verified.

-Andrew

Edited by Andrew Stone, 11 February 2012 - 11:28 AM.

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#4 Mark Schlicher

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Posted 11 February 2012 - 02:58 PM

Someone on the forum (sorry I can't remember who) did fabricate a yoke for his 6.5" Marshall last year, and I think sold a few, but it would undoubtably have to be adapted to mount on a Flyer.

In my opinion the Flyer LE is best-matched to the Marshall 7" (around $1000) or Marshall 6.5" (if daylight viewability is the most important criteria.) Marshall makes an 800nit version of the 7" that is quite good, but not as good as the 6.5 transflective in daylight.

Weight is an issue for sure.

Also, the Marshalls are "choose one" when it comes to HDMI vs. HD-SDI, when last I checked. So whichever you choose, you will have to have a converter such as a Decimator 2, and power arrangements.
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#5 John E Fry

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Posted 11 April 2012 - 05:58 PM

Hi there,

I'm not sure you will need a downconverter with the Marshall (if you are talking about the V-LCD70XHB, or one of its variants) as they have composite video inputs, as well as 3G HD-SDI, or SDI. So pretty useful. If you got one of those you could simply add one of their own HDMI-HDSDI cross converters (or similar thing, BlackMagic make one, as to Atomos to go on the backs of their Samurai & Ninja recorders) which would give you both HDMI and HD-SDI inputs, and the ability to convert on the fly, looping out to something else.

I'm looking at one of these Marshalls, those the actual panel resolution isn't really high enough to justify the 'HD' badge, to my mind. Maybe a second hand Transvideo Superbright 6.5" or this much cheaper alternative ( http://www.xenarcdir...&cat=249&page=1 ) would be almost as good for daylight viewing composite Steadicam monitor. Any thoughts Steadi-gang?
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#6 Rusty Geller

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Posted 11 April 2012 - 07:17 PM

Thanks, I bought the Marshall 7" 3G/SDI with their electronic level-indicator plug-in box. I figure most of the jobs I'll be doing will be digital, where everything I see is in frame, and I can use the camera's framelines. The Marshall also has preset aspect ratios. I went from a PRO with a TB6 to this Marshall, I have to give up something. The picture sure is big and in color. And for jobs when I'm DPing it has false color. When sun hits it directly it glares off the matte screen, but the Marshall sunshade helps a bit. There's always the old trick where you have a grip with a flag follow you shading the screen.
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#7 John E Fry

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Posted 13 April 2012 - 02:08 PM

Hi again,

I find myself posting again because I'm actually in the same position as Rusty. I have a Flyer LE, but after spending years operating with green-screens & latterly the UltraBrite2 the Flyer monitor (despite it's very good colour reproduction) just doesn't cut it for brightness & daylight viewability.

I have narrowed down my options, & wondered what the community of noble instrument operators would perhaps recommend, from your marvellous collective experience?!

- The popular & connectable Marshall 7" V-LCD70XHB-3GSDI 800 nits, the recommended monitor for many applications at the moment - CreativeVideo listing
- The very local (20 miles from me) Teletest CYCLOPS-HD 7" 1500 nits, the brightest, composite SD with optional SDI & HDSDI (it's the Master I use in the pictures!) - Teletest Website
- I've also found a second hand Transvideo Rainbow II 6.5" Ultrabright 900nits, composite SD only, but wonderfully rugged & looks great on Steadicam! - Transvideo Website

All of these three monitors will cost me about £1200 each, which sensibly is all I want to spend, even if I was to use it off the Flyer.

Any thoughts, or votes on these please?!


Thanks in advance!
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#8 Alec Jarnagin SOC

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Posted 20 April 2012 - 03:56 PM

OK,

Anyone used this new Nebtek: http://www.nebtek.co...ts/NEB56HD.html

They have an option for "high Brightness" (still says coming soon on the web site). You'll see on the website that the 7" Solar HD has been discontinued with a new one in the works. This one has a lot of nice features.

=======
From an email:

It offers an 800 nit screen and all of the features of the Solar 7HD plus a firmware upgrade will soon be available that will add waveform, vector, image flip and peaking in red. It is also the perfect tool for working with a DSLR in a professional environment because It takes HDMI and SDI in and outputs in true 1080 HD SDI.

=======

Obviously, this is not a Cinetronic but I am looking for something much smaller and lighter for my custom LW sled. (While I know the next version of the Cinetronic will be smaller, I hope it is not too much smaller or lighter; I like the mass and the solidness of it for my primary sled).

Thanks.
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#9 Robert Starling SOC

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Posted 20 April 2012 - 04:37 PM

...(While I know the next version of the Cinetronic will be smaller, I hope it is not too much smaller or lighter; I like the mass and the solidness of it for my primary sled).


I agree 100% with the mass and weight of the current Cinetronic; love the feel and balance. Frankly it doesn't get in my way ever but for some reason(s) lots of people want a small version and I'll probably get one of those as well.

As for Nebtek; I didn't have a good experience with them at all in the development phase of their current monitor and I think Rich Romero pretty much got boned on his.

Robert
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#10 Dean Smollar

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Posted 20 April 2012 - 06:07 PM

I have the Marshall 7" as my primary monitor, and I love it.

I did fall in love with Will's Cinetronic, so it's on my list of upgrades, but I'll always keep the Marshall around for backup.

Don't know why you would want an HDMI option though.
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#11 Eric Fletcher S.O.C.

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Posted 20 April 2012 - 07:11 PM

I am looking for something much smaller and lighter for my custom LW sled. (While I know the next version of the Cinetronic will be smaller, I hope it is not too much smaller or lighter; I like the mass and the solidness of it for my primary sled).



Cinetronic is also building a 5" monitor for AC's and operators.... sounds like that will be perfect for your use
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#12 Rusty Geller

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Posted 20 April 2012 - 08:30 PM

I am looking for something much smaller and lighter for my custom LW sled. (While I know the next version of the Cinetronic will be smaller, I hope it is not too much smaller or lighter; I like the mass and the solidness of it for my primary sled).



Cinetronic is also building a 5" monitor for AC's and operators.... sounds like that will be perfect for your use



I went with the Marshall 7" V-LCD70XHB-3GSDI 800 nits for 2 reasons:

1. it's supposed to be the brightest

2. it has a plug-in electronic level indicator. After 25 years of having an on-screen level indicator I wasn't going to fly without one. The indicator is a little unit the size of a match box with a 1/4-20 hole and a cable. It powers off the monitor and delivers the level signal thru this cable. I mounted it under the monitor arm of the Flyer, which is fixed (doesn't swing vertically). It's always there and it's always on, so it's a no-think. It has horizontal and vertical levels, I turned off the vertical. The level indicator is a little red triangle that moves along a horizontal line with a few cross hatches, it has adjustable sensitivity, I put it on the fastest but it's still a bit slow. I also have always had a bubble level glued to my monitor arms as a rfeference to set the electronic level, so that is visible also. I also have a bubble level glued to the top stage close to the camera to compare.

The Marshall is bright in sun, with a matte screen. I also bought the Marshall monitor shade. The sun will glare off the screen if it's right down the pipe. In that situation I'd have get someone follow me with a flag. There's always a trade-off. The TB6 is still the brightest thing out there.
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#13 Eric Fletcher S.O.C.

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Posted 20 April 2012 - 09:12 PM

I went with the Marshall 7" V-LCD70XHB-3GSDI 800 nits for 2 reasons:

1. it's supposed to be the brightest



Not even close to the cinetronic monitor, and with the new one if has a built-in frame liner and level display
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#14 Mark Schlicher

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Posted 20 April 2012 - 10:41 PM

Rusty,

How satisfied are you with the Marshall level indicator? How does it compare with what you've used in the past?
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#15 Eric Fletcher S.O.C.

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Posted 21 April 2012 - 12:44 AM

One quick thing. Present hd monitor technology induces at least a 2 frame delay when you have frame lines or an electronic on-screen level. just an FYI
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